My take is close to that of the OP:

1) It's still LeBron + a bunch of roll players + an aging Shaq.

However, I wouldn't say bench players, I'd say roll players. Mo and Shaq can still play at near all-star level, but nowhere near the elite players at their positions (Paul, Parker, Nash, Deron, Howard, Yao, Duncan).

The rest are VERY good roll players. AV, Delonte, Z, and Parker.

2) LeBron's J is much improved this year. But he still settles far too often, or jacks up ill-advised early threes, or gets J happy when he hits a couple. He needs to attack the basked more, and develop a post up game. A see signs that he has done so. The hook shot. And if the J is solid, we  could be seeing an awful lot of turnaround J's over folks from the baseline or at the elbow.

3) AV and Boobie are both better this year than last.

4) Shaq is an upgrade.

5) We still can add a nice piece or two. Powe in the winter will help. Someone like Daniels, or even Wally would be an upgrade over Karl/Jawad/D-Block on the bench.

Delonte's situation is worrisome, but he's back on the court at least. And I'm not the biggest Mike Brown fan.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There are going to be bumps in the road, the 66 win thing will probably never happen again. and 40-2 at home was all time NBA good, don't expect that again.

Oh, and by the way, other than Dirk, we have the best stretch 4 in the league = LeBron James.

Nov 7, 2009 -- 7:55AM, CbusCavsFan wrote:

 As a diehard Cavs fan I dont even want to think about the future of the organization if this is the end. I can't imagine Mr Gilbert keeping the Cavs around if the unthinkable were to happen. What really worries me is that I agree with alot of your points. Danny Ferry has yet to bring in a true all-star to play next to Lebron. The kid has been a Cavalier for 7 seasons and the best he could do is Mo Williams and an old Shaq? Thats not good enough. He made a HUGE mistake in holding onto Wallays contract last season. I was under the impression that the only reason we acquired Wally in that trade a few years back was so we could deal him at the deadline. What does Ferry do? He holds onto him and his huge expiring contract. Expiring contracts are gold in the NBA, he could have found a team to take it. Oh wait, we didnt get rid of him because we didnt want to ruin the "chemistry" of the team. Great move Danny. Outside of Lebron his drafts have been AWFUL. Name me ONE guy that Ferry has drafted thats seeing significant time for the Cavs since we drafted Lebron? Even if he were to draft a NBA ready player our head coach is too ignortant and stubborn to give them a chance. I dont understand how he passed on Matt Barnes for Jamario Moon. I'd rather have a guy that is capable of getting 20 a night then a guy that cant get off the bench. Barnes was there for the taking but we passed on him for Moons defense. It is imperative that Danny Ferry trade Z at some point this season. He has a huge expiring contract and Ferry needs to use it to bring in another guy.There will be plenty of teams looking to clear some room for the big FA class, Ferry needs to take advantage of this. I love Z as much as the next guy but loyalty has never won a title, talent has. I dont want to say that its over but Ferry and Brown need to get some things figured out and get them figured out fast. This team is not good enough to win a NBA title if its left as it is. Its so frustrating because they are soooo close but arent quite there yet. I just hope that Ferry can see this before it too late. Go Cavs!

agreeed

diehard also here.   players might not want to play for potato head

solid  thread here guys - lots of insight and agree with many opinions

in my opinion boozer leaving was the killer for me.  there was no way to replace him .  he was lebrons pippen only a bigger bruizer.   we had the dynasty with two huge athletic skilled bodies in the king and boozer.  we didnt need to hold on to Z who even at that time we knew couldnt play in the pressures of playoff ball.

i could never figure out why gilbert hired a defensive rookie coach.  you need a well rounded coach with a history to coach the king who has been ready to win for a while.   why hire a coach who has to learn  on the job

business error commited by gilbert ,  now years later we are hurting along with the passed time

we need to trade Z as its proven he cant produce in the playoffs and lets hope for a near miracle because that is what it will take for us to win the title this season

go cavs

Nov 7, 2009 -- 12:53PM, zman wrote:

Nov 7, 2009 -- 8:20AM, Daniel wrote:

 

I for one would be very dissapointed if Lebron took the easy way out and looked to hook up with a couple other all stars to win a ring in some obscure irrelevant City just to say "I won a ring". Yes, that is the easy way out, and as a fan of the NBA first and foremost and a student of the ways of Micheal Jordan, I have always believed that the true measure of a champion isn't how he performed when things were going his way but rather when the chips were down. At the moment I see Lebron reaching the greatness of MJ as an NBA player. I believe his greatness is being tested this season. It's been mentioned ad nauseum but at this point in Jordan's career he wonhis first ring. I think due to coincidence this season for Lebron is his time also. I know people will say that Lebron can't carry the team to a championship on his own. After all that's what he's done for most of the last 6 seasons. Yet the challenge is there just as it was for Jordan and he took it and so  should and I believe will, Lebron James. If he doesn't do it this season yet persists and continues to accept the challenge I believe he will achieve his goal and be considered a great. If he doesn't do it this season and throws in the towel on Cleveland then "buys" himself a championship at another franchise he will go down as just another star with one or more rings on his finger/s.

I was going to finish there but I wanted to say and ask one more thing - I believe Lebron James is the best player in the NBA today. So if he needs a Pippen-esque player to get his rings who would that be? Would Wade be happy to play second fiddle to Lebron? How about Dwight? or better yet Kobe? These men each have their own legacies already so how can Lebron possibly set himself apart  from them in terms of greatness and play alongside any of them without taking away from his own or their legacies?

Wow where did that come from?!?!?!

 

No offense but the NBA, today, has teams that consist of 3, 4 or what some may consider 5 allstars on a team.  Yes the Celtics have a potential 5 All star lineup right now.  The Lakers have a 3 all star lineup as well as the Magic.  All 3 of these teams also have good 2nd units.  Gone are the days where greatness was diverse and widespread.  To win a championship you have to look at the era you are competing in and not rely on what was once the formula to win. Wade and Bosh want to be on winning teams as well.  These guys are all team players and want to be at the top regardless of how it's done.

I would love for Lebron, his role players, and his inadequate coaching staff to win the championship.  It would only show just how dominant he really is but the likelyhood of that happening is slim when you have teams like ORL BOS and LA.. 

In terms of Boston, that is the reason I have little to no respect for any of those all star players. Their whole demeanour is arrogant and annoying. Having re-read my post I realise that I might have made a mistake by just stating the term all star. After all Lebron is on a team with two current and one former all star in Mo , Shaq and Z respectivley. I meant a team that consisted of say D12 and Wade alongside Lebron. I can't see how Lebron could seperate himself from these two to further his own legacy, which I believe is his main motivation. In regards to your remark about Wade and Bosh I also think that's a big stretch. Bosh on his own very plausible. I just can't see Wade and Lebron co-existing. You could imagine my horror when I read the article by that Smith dude from the Bulls making a case for Lebron going to LA to play along side Kobe. Imagine what sort of damage that would do to Lebrons Legacy. It would be written about how, without Kobe, Lebron was/is nothing etc etc etc... People are paranoid about losing Lebron, I'm paranoid about Lebron losing himself!!!

Nov 7, 2009 -- 9:37PM, realist wrote:

Nov 7, 2009 -- 8:20AM, Daniel wrote:

Nov 7, 2009 -- 7:01AM, realist wrote:

Zman,I have been watching and going to Cavs games since they came into the league in 1970 and I have witnessed some awful basketball and I imagine I will again because afterall,this is Cleveland and that is our lot in life with all sports.

 I think what you said is spot on,we have,as usual,a bunch of role players besides James.Ferry has failed to get him his Pippen.Yes it is early and I expect them to get better after playing with each other longer but they are what they are.Moon after playing with 100 teams isn`t going to turn into Pippen and the same with Parker,very average.These guys are just small step ups from Damon Jones and Donyell Marshalls.

 I won`t lose alot of sleep if James decides he wants to hang out with other idiots in NY or LA,I could care less,I have more important things in my life than what a bunch of overpaid brats do.

I don't mean to nit pick but I think you meant " I couldn't care less..............."?

Now on to more important subjects at hand.............

I want to believe that Lebron James is his own person. So when people say Ferry hasn't got Lebron his Pippen I say, maybe he doesn't need one.

Lebron James bleeds Akron. Which equates to a love for Cleveland. Surely he feels the same way as any other Ohio-an about the lack of silver/gold ware in the cabinet and wants to do something about it. He has a young family he lives the good life in the place he loves. He can go where he pleases when ever he wants. I have always seen Lebron as being down to earth and well rounded. I guess what I am trying to say is that from what I have seen and heard Lebron James will stay in Cleveland to win a championship for his people.

I for one would be very dissapointed if Lebron took the easy way out and looked to hook up with a couple other all stars to win a ring in some obscure irrelevant City just to say "I won a ring". Yes, that is the easy way out, and as a fan of the NBA first and foremost and a student of the ways of Micheal Jordan, I have always believed that the true measure of a champion isn't how he performed when things were going his way but rather when the chips were down. At the moment I see Lebron reaching the greatness of MJ as an NBA player. I believe his greatness is being tested this season. It's been mentioned ad nauseum but at this point in Jordan's career he wonhis first ring. I think due to coincidence this season for Lebron is his time also. I know people will say that Lebron can't carry the team to a championship on his own. After all that's what he's done for most of the last 6 seasons. Yet the challenge is there just as it was for Jordan and he took it and so  should and I believe will, Lebron James. If he doesn't do it this season yet persists and continues to accept the challenge I believe he will achieve his goal and be considered a great. If he doesn't do it this season and throws in the towel on Cleveland then "buys" himself a championship at another franchise he will go down as just another star with one or more rings on his finger/s.

I was going to finish there but I wanted to say and ask one more thing - I believe Lebron James is the best player in the NBA today. So if he needs a Pippen-esque player to get his rings who would that be? Would Wade be happy to play second fiddle to Lebron? How about Dwight? or better yet Kobe? These men each have their own legacies already so how can Lebron possibly set himself apart  from them in terms of greatness and play alongside any of them without taking away from his own or their legacies?

Wow where did that come from?!?!?!

Thanks for correcting me.

 "some obscure irrelevant city"?What city is more irrelevant than Cleveland,Ohio?Free agents don`t come knocking the door down to play here,they run away.

 I don`t even think that I am talking a Bryant,Wade or any of those studs,I wanted Antwaan Jamison as our power forward and I was given all kinds of gas by people but then everyone has been saying we need a PF who can shoot from the outside,who is better than him?I also like the idea of Troy Murphy and a played like the Grainger kid in Indy.A real good PF and a slick tall shooting guard would do wonders.

When I say "some obscure irrelevant city" it's in relation to Lebron. Lets take LA for example ( as has been touted). If Lebron were to go there it would be Obscure because it's nowhere near where he's from and irrelevant because it would be detrimental to what I believe is his Legacy. I mean you are clearly a beaten man when it comes to Cleveland sports so surely someone like Lebron, who is at the "coal face" of proffessional sports would feel the same, if not more, pain than you. I just think that it would be an amazing piece of his Legacy to be able to bring Cleveland a ring and I'm sure that not only is he aware of it but it is part of his plans. 

As for getting players to help James on his path. I'm all for signing the likes of Jamison. Personally I wish Ferry could have made a better push for David Lee. I don't know what it is but you remark about free agents running away as true as it may be is hard to believe. Last off season/summer it was discussed ad nauseum about our lack of cap space so that makes it hard for us to sign anyone. Then what I don't understand is with Lebron here you would think guys would be excited to come here to play along side the king? Hmmm might have to look into that a bit more............ Regardless, my aim in saying these things is to quash the constant negative chatter around our CAVS. Last season we won 66 with a good team and missed it by [] this much. This season I know that on paper we are a better side than last season however I am also a realist and know that we need more time to find our combinations. This means we probably won't break 60 wins but I am confident that come the playoffs we'll be there and ready to go all the way. Boston's grumpy old men brigade will be out of puff. The "how to beat Orlando" playbook will be worked out and in the hands of every team in the East. Then come The Finals the Cavs will be that hot that either Popovich goes postal when we sweep them or  Kobe will be wearing Reeboks for the rest of his career. The only team I fear at the moment is Denver but we'll see........It's a long season don't forget!

plus 

chicago-bulls and bears

milwaukee-green bay is their nfl city

boston-celts, pats

poor argument